transcript —
The Witches Symposium with Gnostic Informant and Lady Babylon

[Watch on YouTube] | Timestamped transcript

Transcript

Hello everyone and welcome to drawing down the stars I'm your host Snappy and today we're having our witches Symposium so thank you all for tuning in the idea of this is to have sort of like a fun casual conversation where we're talking about deep philosophical metaphysical

Topics you know where we want to get into the mean of things and you know like I've been puffing on the asterian I'm sure everyone else here has been having a good time and you know we just want to kind of really have kind of a round table free-flowing discussion so to start things off I'm just going to open it up by defining magic in religion studies you know magic is usually defined as any kind of ritual act that's done to change reality in accordance with one's desire so what do you guys

Think about that and does anyone want to start things off and just introduce yourself when you do please my name is NASA conformant and I you know the definition can is uh is interesting because people think of magic and they think of they think of like a Disney movie with the wand and or they're pulling a pulling a bird out of a hat or doing some magic trick with some cards or something but it really is just

In the ancient world anything that you can do to enact your will upon the world around you it could be anything it could be telling it could be telling something in someone's ear like this and then they go off and they do a task for you and then that task ends up creating something that you needed to be done so that you can go and finish off what you want that's it it could be something like that and so that term magic it's like it's been changed over time but I think I think what you're doing right

Now is you're bringing it back to the original context you know yeah that's what we're kind of trying to get people to perceive it how it would have been right like and how a lot of various spiritual and religious Traditions actually view magic not what we kind of imagined it as in our kind of our scientific era where we disparage all this stuff right it's really all about kind of trying to imagine these various artistic actions that people are doing and and trying to talk about them

And how and how they work and whatnot like I know for example go ahead sorry I also said this too and then there's the other there's the other aspect of it is that you like this is the ritual aspect of it where you really want something to be done and then so you perform these rights and these rights

Um what they do is they sort of spark something with inside of you and that will for whatever reason make it more likely that you can actually go out and like you see you'll see this with like sports teams where they get together and they all get they all get in the circle and they'll start like getting real Rowdy and like that pumps them up before the game and like that's a form of Magic Ritual right there because that got them into the into that zone

They don't even realize it that's what that's what that's that's what it would have been defined as in the ancient world totally like I think about like the earliest examples of when we talk of magic from like an academic perspective it's cave cave drawings and what are they doing they're they're imagining themselves going out into the world and catching the game that they want and then they're showing themselves in Victory having having caught that animal right so it's this act of creating the reality you want into the future and like wretch I know you you've done a lot

Of research into a lot of this magic stuff and I know a lot of magic in the early kind of ancient peoples was all around these mennonic devices do you wanna you wanna kind of talk about that right well you gave a good definition of magic it seems like a lot of Scholars like to debate it endlessly as if they're as if every culture agreed as to what magic was or how it worked and and there's a lot of individuality in there too really it seems like it's the individual approach

To religion in some cases rather than the organized approach that's a really good way to talk about it because you see that in a lot of our religious studies textbooks they want to really emphasize this uh difference that magic is your individual action and religion is that communal enforcement of uh of action so one group's magic isn't you know might be called they might call it a miracle and then another group calls it magic according to who's demonizing who or whatever but uh

It's it's at the so there's a lot of different ways to explain it but it uh definitely affects Consciousness ritual affects Consciousness and this was had practical value from the earliest times to encode all of the tribes knowledge into a mnemonic device and to understand nature

And as they understood nature they tried to interact with it and uh work with it or manipulate it so magic is at the root of technology and science and art it's the source of all of it ultimately

Yeah that's beautiful Emmon I wanted to ask you so like when you're looking at the ancient Greek world and you're and they're talking about like how are they perceiving magic are they perceiving it in this very kind of Desire uh based kind of will manifestation stuff because one thing that strikes me about the Greeks is they kind of expand it so radically like you get that whole idea of fear G which is actually drawing down these Divine like how does that fit in I think of you asked what you think of when you think of magic and I think of

Sex I think of sex and drugs and I think a ceremony and music and I think of images and catch phrases I think of passwords and codes and initiations I think of initiation when I think of magic I think of Jesus in that Cemetery with that kid I think of that kind of hot steamy side of existence where you can

Draw to yourself every human being on the planet right you can you can bring that power to bear that's what I think of when I think of magic you can you can talk about classical definitions of it which I don't want to um but I was uh just this morning you know run to home or check out Cersei right they're all like oh God here's a drug the Sorceress is in the palace this is bronzes right oh God you know you're gonna get no don't go in there she's

Gonna turn you into an animal she's even drugged this is one we haven't gotten to yet tell this to the people at Menorca it's also the animals man right imagine that you have such a power you know I think you're such a power with these drugs that you can be giving them to people and creating

Creating pigment pigment whom you will sodomize into submission and if you don't because you have the antidote oh man what are we going to do now we're gonna go through the riot and have sex right and ultimately if we don't eat the abortions we're going to produce the child that we can put through that death people don't realize that Cersei killed Odysseus she killed Odysseus she had sex with him and killed him and that's what the Byzantine Scholars are so interested how does she do that it's

Okay because she raised him from the dead so when I think of magic that's what I think of I think of sexiness and drugs and you know Dark Places I think at night they call them night rituals for a reason right so that's kind of that's kind of where I go you know what I was just wondering why you're while you're saying that is the sorcerer witch magic those aren't bad words in the later World post-christianity those are bad words evil you're dead but you want to stake

And burn you alive those are bad words but before in this in the time of Homer this was like a a title of someone distinguished who had knowledge who knew things who had extra who was educated this would be like a modern day PhD like the sorcerer PhD or the witch M.A you know what I mean like these are people with super high knowledge of new things and knew how to do certain stuff that most people didn't know how to do and my question is like what happened by the way even Jesus gets called the sorcerer by his own people in the talmud

Right exactly you know and like we were just talking about Odysseus right these epics are designed to try to tell us that what's most important about a culture and is supposed to impart the most important ideas what is Odysseus doing he's going out to learn the magic right what does he do after he's dead and resurrected by Cersei he goes and literally digs a trench and dives into the underworld to meet his mentor tyreseus right who tells him the future you know and he's battling off the dead

He's he's slitting the throats of of black boars you know and they even talk about he puts this ergotized wine that he's pouring all over the place like it's a very methodic understood ritual they're doing this analog where they're they're transporting themselves it's like it's it's powerful stuff and that's in the earliest Greek texts right yeah and those big cities that they built you know we're talking Bronze Age right in this big cities they built with the cyclopean blocks I've been there I've stood under the Gateway of one of those you know and when it says in the Odyssey that Cersei comes out of her

Giant polished Stone Palace right right and opens both the doors right because it's you know it's not like everybody else's house it's a palace right and you got to think about what level of sophistication do you have do you have that's my Society yeah

She's not some random witch living in the woods that everybody is like looking down on they're looking up on her she's distinguished

The people at the Dig in Menorca they said uh you know it's surprising the level they said there has to be a level of knowledge there that's well beyond it's like expert you know pharmaceutical knowledge they called they call had titles for this Polo Fatima corn these were the ones who mastered these substances right and um the power there goes directly from that figure from that queen that my city and queen to the oracles and so that power you have limited with Christianity you don't there's a reason the drugs and the Satanism are all connected to that oracular figure yeah love it I love it

Let me throw something let me throw something at you all you and hear what you guys think because when you look at like Merlin he I think Merlin is like the the last good example of like what a sorcerer but a state a state Source we're supposed to do this well their job is to work with the King and get things done on the side through their magic through their knowledge through whatever whatever ways they have to get things done they have to do it so

They're doing all this extra behind the scenes they're like the CIA in a way the FBI they're like the they're like the underground the the knowledge the in the intelligence basically Intelligentsia and so the ancient in the ancient world you have in every Kingdom you have if they have one a good sorcerer a good magician a good Magi to help them you know like like get like make sure that the things on the on the ground level are getting done

You absolutely need to read about John D in John D I believe is the last the truly last Magician of the type that you're describing he was the court magician for um Queen Victoria and he was in charge of her secret police and like wretch can elaborate on John that's queen Queen Elizabeth not Queen Victoria sorry that's my best and what I think what I think Christian what I think the Catholic Church ended up doing is they sort of take that framework but instead of having magicians and Sorcerers you

Have like Bishops and like they're doing the same type of dirty work but it's like it's only definitely and you still love this all over right like you also see a lot of this in like the African traditions and whatnot like I wanted to ask Dion about this because Dion you traveled all around Africa and a lot through Amazon so you're dealing and you dealt with and you purposely sought out some a lot of these tribal groups that were doing these more traditional ancient practices like are you seeing them continuing this kind of a magic base and are they doing

The same kind of will magic that we're talking about sure it's still there uh I was surprised in Africa it's very animist you know and the church is there too and Islam is very big uh and even Islam and Christianity in Africa is uh it has they have a fervor to it they get very excited you know uh and they have a lot of the atomist uh culture still mixes it's it's syncratic like in uh Cuban Santeria in Yoruba culture

You know you and you were they'll name the Saints are really just African Gods Chango and ogun and these different gods they give them Christian names of Christian Saints that's how it is man yeah yeah they had to do it to go underground but still in Africa it's still big today you know they you have a they have their national holidays societies you can go it's uh recognized in their culture as a legit form of religion and I remember you tell me about when you spent some time in Benin and you

Were telling me about the prominence of the women there who were the central leaders of the of the snake Cults and were in charge of most of the culture right well no this is a certain section and for a certain reason now now this deals with uh that city is called Wida it was a slave Port you know where the they're getting the slaves there and uh they've taken the men and the children the boys and so the women were left behind so the women naturally became a matriarchal culture there in this old

Slave port and they had the the different uh Voodoo ways and later on in modern times after uh you know the slavery's over and and everything's tamed down women still in that culture to this day are approached by something called the widower Society which is this uh patriarchal Voodoo in society because they still wield power in that City you know men are afraid of them and they they're they're famous for poisoning men and with their food and you know and they but it it came naturally it was a it came out of the slavery

Because they took all the men and the ironic part is you know it was the other tribes selling off the other tribes sometimes the the slavers didn't even get off the boat they stayed on the boat there and then they would the other tribes would fight and kidnap different tribes and send them there and then towards the end they said they just told the other the tribe yeah well you get on too we need you too and they took them all damn

But you know there they have the the snake you're talking about the snake temple and that's a the python temples and they're my experience there I'll be honest I got sick I don't pull over the car and I threw up I I gotta I go I don't like this place he goes They're laughing at me he goes he goes well I knew you were going to get that way because there's a real heavy vibe in the city and it still like has the old architecture I think

Portuguese like a portrait it looks like a Portuguese Sports you know since uh old uh slave Port there but when you go to the python temples you know they're they're trained they're evolved they grow up with these uh pythons and these snakes some of them are defanged some of them are non-venomous but the ones that are venomous they build up immunities to it they're handling it over the years imagine you give it's you know micro dosing like in Silicone Valley where those CEOs were taking minute amounts of LSD

Well my nude amounts of the the Venom like my new my new we're talking like there's a famous guy and all those Vice documentaries Steve Ludwin who's been injecting himself regularly with snake venoms of all kinds of types for over 25 years now so oh yeah yeah yeah yeah you know so they build up an immunity to it and they're what it's mainly today it's tourists they take tourists there and charge them thousands of bucks to have initiations and you know that's what they're doing I don't even wanna I'm not

Into that stuff I went there to Africa I was more into uh Eastern philosophy when I went there at the time so I wasn't really into the voodoo stuff and my buddy that I was staying with the shaman he wasn't into Voodoo either he studied in you know even though it was the African Shaman kid went to France and studied theater and so he was into a bunch of existentialism and so he's like you don't need this Voodoo stuff because what happens with the voodoo stuff you

Get stuck on you get a flat tire and you think your neighbor hexed you and you're trying to make people fall in love with you you know if someone doesn't love you they just don't love you you know right no no there isn't dangers with a lot of the black magic and stuff but I always find it's interesting is these snake Cults and these mother goddess calls these seem to be the oldest and most predominant images that you see cross-culturally right like we have those Venus figurines that date

Like over 250 000 years old some of them by pre-humans you know like it's it's it's wild to think about how ancient this kind of roots are right yeah yeah the connections between snakes and drugs seems to be pretty Universal and very ancient look at the medical symbol right now go to any Hospital any any Hospital look on the look on the window you'll see the serpent on the staff yeah either Hermes are asclepius either

Way

I'm I cut you off going my bad I'm sorry I just wanted to I was so excited to say that for some reason I'm sorry go ahead can I ask Dion real quick is there a sexual aspect to the serpent play in Africa is there some kind of connection there I'm interested in bringing back the old pornaya right why how can you have a word that means both to um to have sex and to practice the religion

To practice the mystery how can that or as they would have called them 100 years ago idolatry and fornication right well how can you have those two things joined together did you in your adventures did you come across the anybody who managed to capture that ancient Venus association with you know

You know the act itself and the orgasm and all that kind of stuff yeah I didn't participate but I I witnessed you know I I saw a lot of stuff you know and you gotta understand when I went this was a 93 and then I went back again a different time in 94. you know a long time ago and I was what in my early 20s then and uh I was saying one time when I walked up in a certain Village I'm the only white person

You know and I'm I'm mixed but to them I'm blonde and blue eyed and they all came up around me and started touching on me and my friend said yeah they never saw like they don't see white guys much and so the women when I'd walk up they'd cover up their breasts because they were uncovered they don't wear bras or they're uncovered just working and they they would when they saw me and I tell my friend like why are they doing that and he goes well because they know you're

Turned on by their by their breasts and we're not wow Ah that's crazy so but but I did but where the story is going is though I was kind of a Target for black magic because I went to the capital of voodoo and I and I met the president of the voodoo Society went to his house in the per the people I was staying with was the minister of arts and culture of the country in Africa there uh dahome Benin and so

I already knew to be careful like like you're going into the heart of it where they're all hexing each other and of course they want to get a a guy from America you know you get a Visa or you can get some money and everyone just thought out they thought I was a millionaire you know you you know what I was doing before I went to Africa I was working at Little Caesars

You know to be honest why not right on man I did my Pizza Hut you know what I mean you know what I mean it's the best job in the world right um where Where do you um in that process uh can you get drugs can you get can you get drugged and tricked or can you get drugged and robbed yeah it happened to me I was drug tricked and robbed all the above oh wow yeah uh you know in malaria I got malaria each time several times

And even though you could get thousand dollars with the shots back then they forced you even to get into the country it was third on the list of the diseases and I had to get a thousand dollars worth of shots that didn't work obviously and my African buddies told me that when they go home they get sick and then when they come here they get sick it's just different amoebas and parasites in the water you know nothing you can do about it so but my first time I was there they took me

To a bar to celebrate that night like welcome to Africa thing and and they're drinking beers and the guy offers me Palm wine and he goes oh you're gonna love this and like ah and it was really sweet it's from the palm trees and I only had a cup of it and I remember we got it to leave and they had to carry me I was when I hit the door I was passing out and they're laughing and so I was like oh that was my first

Night so I'm like you know I'm gonna be careful and so and I was hanging out with the people that do the magic potions and stuff so with the women they're trying to do that to you that's normal that's what my buddy told me like be careful with the women

I saw a video I'm trying to find it right now and I don't know where it is maybe it was maybe it was just not on YouTube but there were they were um like trying to get in with this tribe and hang out with them and they were drinking and it was like an alcohol mixed with cocaine

And it was like they and the person was like we drink this to keep the spirits off of us the bad spirits and I was like damn this is a different [\\h__\\h] over here it's wild so we have a pretty cool question here that I think we can all kind of Riff on so uh Trent little asks the rod of Aaron turns into a serpent is it related is it euphemism Ammon do you want to start this off yeah why are they turning their rods into serpents in the first place why is it when everybody's getting look in Antiquity when you get when you get

Bitten by something right and or you get stung or you get clipped by an arrow that's got a Venom on it and you gotta go see somebody right away you gotta run to the person who has the knowledge of that Viper you gotta run to that person those are the bakkens people don't think about there's Balkans are perpetuating a very Advanced pharmacology that's why we find people with hallucinogens in their system these are those crazy hallucinogens from the Bronze Age right so yeah that serpent it's just because we're out of the context to us this is only an issue because we don't we're not

In the context right but for anybody from for Moses is holding up the serpent dude dude where was the guy trained right he's trained in Egypt with the best priests you know he knows what he's doing that guy is a drug if you were to take Moses's hair you'd find all kinds of drugs in there look what happened the guy Riley's the one who who whose glorious emanated from him after seeing the presence right and being there he made that Temple it wasn't Temple it was a tent but it was like a temple and it

Drew that presence to call him a fire dude it's so Smoky you got to pull those people out that's um it there's Aaron's Rod right yeah there's Aaron's rock if you are Jewish and you think anything about anything about the Holy writings and the religion because honestly a lot of Jews don't a lot of Israelis that I knew were like we're like I'm not going to say it but after religion I was like really I was like really that's you know I'm sure I'm sure Neil you probably traveled in certain circles but all the Israeli

Soldiers that I've spent a year with over there dude they were so secular they were they were just so Israel's now yeah yeah but if you were following the religion you would know what that serpent was you would know what that healing was yeah so it's definitely there those drugs are there Moses was a drugged out guy man he was a drugged out satanistan Ron's age attorney and religion my new theory that I'm working on it's a hypothesis is that the characters of Aaron and Moses are

Somewhat inspired by the constellations ophiuchus and Orion

And by the way the the Babylonian there's a Babylonian version of Orion where Orion it's it's his name the name is ur namu the light of the heaven and so um or namu he doesn't have a bow he has a staff and so and by and so this and and also Gilgamesh is related to Orion too so the con so Gilgamesh is Orion basically um and can I just say Neil can I just add as soon as you start talking constellations Stars Moon Sun all of a sudden you are

In Bronze Age religion this is this is before everything that we're talking about with Judaism Christianity and Islam you're in the pre-time baby right now absolutely and here's why I think that because number one those two constellations are linked because they're like they're like a pole they're never seen in the sky at the same time they're exactly on the opposite side of the heavens so ophiocus and Orion are exactly opposite side of the spectrum ofayukis has the serpent staff he's the Healer

Um also he's the son of Apollo the law giver and then according to eratosthenes Apollo is a demo the there is no constellation of Apollo but when they talk about Apollo in the sky they just point to oviukas it's the same spot so you have opiocas being a law giver and holding up a serpent staff Moses Orion also holding up a staff like Aaron does he's standing right in front of the bowl the calf what does Aaron do in the text he offers up a Brazen calf he's the Orion constellation is literally

Standing right in front of the calf so I think there's something to be said there you could be very on to something that's really interesting I know like one thing when I think about Moses and stuff like I was talking with wretch about this on our on occult explorers the other days like the eighth book of Moses in its connection to the orphic tradition like what's going on with this museus character that you see coming up in these orphic texts that then later Jews are correlating with Moses

Um do you want to talk about anything of that Reg well I I do have a few more things to add about the uh serpent staff there I mean there's definitely multiple layers to that even if there was a I could see Moses actually being using the snake venom it comes up with like the Brazen Serpent and stuff there's so there's a lot going on there with Moses and serpents but it's it's actually more important in Jewish apocryphal texts or other Jewish texts than the Old

Testament than you might think so it's actually often depicted as a sapphire serpent staff and the staff of Moses is the same as the staff of Aaron and uh we we learn about it in the book of jasher and how Moses actually stole it from the midianites by conning Jethro and getting his wife there but it it was placed in the Ark of the Covenant it's still there there's a variety of ways that symbol of a sapphire serpent could be interpreted uh like as The Milky Way or it seems to be actually plagiarized from the Egyptians and their uh

Blue serpent wajet uh

Or Uranus serpent with the wings there might actually be the Prototype of even the caduceus but uh there's a so there's a whole bunch of symbolism that could be pulled out of that but it it's certainly possible that he was using the Venom too so or everything like he was using everything else apparently so why would he why would he retch if if we've can we really declare Moses Among Us can we just get it out there and say look Moses and Jesus are both Magi they're both

Performing within this certain area and the eighth book of Moses is full of the same sort of magic that you see throughout the Greco-Roman tradition so um there's not really a big leap between Moses the mogas and and Jesus the mogress um we're talking about the same acts right I mean Jesus is still boasting the fact that you can he's gonna he's gonna bring you to the point that you could be exposed to these Venoms and not have any problem with it right he's promising you

The antidote right there so do you think Moses I mean say we get his hair sample of Moses right say if we get lucky you know and one of these you know archaeologists says hey you know we've got here's a sample and uh we go ahead and test it and he's full he's full of the Venoms and he's full of the compound he's got the burning purple in him he's been getting it from those Phoenicians right that's where he's been getting it um he's full of drugs man this guy's a this guy's a whoa he's what do we do

When we find out Moses is a drugged out sorcerer yeah he's definitely a magician I mean this is just a matter of one like what I was saying one religion one person's Miracle is another person's magic right so yeah he's having he's having a duel of the of yeah yeah he's having a magical duel and in the later occult text they don't make any bones about it that this is who they learn their magic from they're calling it magic and they're attributing it to Moses and other people and they say Moses actually

Does it through the power of the serpent staff more than like God doing it right through him he's saying is actually the staff and the staff has in certain texts at least has like the names of God on it by which you can do the magic like a very capitalistic kind of view of things but uh it's also kind of like chakras on the spine in a way and you gotta have the right mantras for it or you bring it into the magic tent in in to HotBox in that uh Grand key of Solomon

Christian Jewish and Muslims all have veneration for the serpent staff of Moses and as as the way that he worked his magic by the way that the idea of a magic staff comes from like stories of Bacchus having his thrises like you don't like um Moses is the story of Moses the first story that we have well actually we don't even have it anymore the first time someone mentions a story about Moses is from this hecateus of abdera character who's living in Alexandria Egypt and it

Doesn't surprise me that because people the reason why I bring this up people always ask why does Moses need his staff why can't God just do this why can't why does Moses have to have a staff and all these other characters like they don't even need anything Elijah didn't need a staff but it's like um that because it's because they had magic in the ancient world the idea of like having a staff in your hand the Thrice system doing Miracles with it and Performing rights with it

Those are ideas that come from this ancient Greek Bakken world you know ofiyukis Bacchus and they always they all had staffs in their hands so I'm not surprised that Moses would have the staff in his hand if his story is coming out of Alexandria if Moses was anywhere near the magic from the time that he was in he had a rod and that Rod was used to introduce the drug into the anus we see it on the Greek side so it's not we shouldn't find it odd that um these accoutrement are

There that they have these instruments you know so cool yeah I was going to say that right like the magic wand is really the alabasteron right and they're talking about how they're administering these drugs and using it to fly the riches are riding their broomsticks they're using their magic wands it's all euphemistic language it's a very apparent when you look into the the the Norse ritual because all of the Norse men do not want to engage in what they call ergi women's magic because it requires you to submit to the Priestess

They don't tell you what exactly but they say that you have to become a feminate and submit and this is the worst thing for endorsed men to do right but that's the price if you want to engage you know wow there was a really cool question and this one I wanted to bring up because Ammon and I and wretch and Dion we we'd all been talking about this recently on Discord is the Pleiades you know what are the Richer connections with the Pleiades before we before I want to hear

Amon on this but I just want to throw this out there because I was reading Thomas Paine the other day and he threw he he um he said something I never thought about so the Book of Job is considered to be the oldest book in the Old Testament most Scholars agree on that but it mentions Pleiades he mentions Orion it mentions the bear and and uh Thomas Paine is like these are Greek constellations you see this book has to have been had to have been Greek first

Now Amma what do you think is that true Yeah Yeah from the language itself that's why I kept yelling at people saying the more you read a Septuagint the more Greek it gets you can't deny the fact that this is called this is a Greek story in colloquial Greek Expressions yeah and I think that's why waking people up with the children of Earth and Sky you know the whole Genesis I think that's important and um a lot of the concepts that you don't understand from the prophets for example those will

Come through on the Greek side and they didn't know what the masoretic Jews didn't know what to do with those texts how how do you have a centaur with a horse that's the size of the horse of a penis right how do you ex how do you experience in the temple too and the Greek word for this dude is petterest right um the one transferring the knowledge of the drugs to the to the elite aristocratic youth did they have those deals in Africa they probably didn't

Have the aristocratic youth getting there education did they

Um well you know in Africa secret societies are really secret societies they they keep things very close knit very tight together you know uh and there and you are initiated as young uh boys or girls into these Cults and like it's it's male and female it's very specific and and it's the different gods at that you know they got a host of Gods that almost connects to the Egyptian Pantheon of gods you know the Nigerian and the West African Gods you know I want to bring up something about you're

Talking about the scepters in Moses in Egypt um there's various sectors that the pharaohs would work with one you have a uas a scepter um that's a famous one that has the curve it has a fork at the bottom with the head of a Anubis at the top there or Seth and you also have something called the Jed pillar which is very famous raising the Jed ceremony of the raising of the jet pillar which is all over the the pyramids and the walls of ancient Egypt there and so

They're and it deals with snakes too you know the Cobra wrapping around these pillars you know back in ancient Egypt but some people from Rosa deals with electricity electrical current right right well the jet is also explicitly the spine the spine of Osiris so there's all these hints that Kundalini like practices in Egypt but it's hard to really make out what what the heck is going on there and I'm pretty sure if you were to put uh the medicated alabastron

In the backside you would feel the spike of energy going up your Kundalini up your you know up your spine yeah and that's what that's what they talk about in Tantra and different

To your spine and then it gets the power going I guess and well whatever what is it I'm sorry Snappy what is it with the um um uh this phallus of Osiris what is it with that why do we always seem to come back in the cult to that phallus right the whole thing doesn't work without some kind of sexual golden fellas deal in it what do you think when Cyrus resurrects the first part of his body that rises is his phallus and and the first thing that Isis does is become

A bird she turns into a bird and she goes and flies and hovers over his Palace takes his seed so she jerks him off and then that's how she gives birth to Horus that's exactly what we did that's exactly what Medea does to Prometheus exactly what Medea and flies oh my God I gotta look into that that's crazy going back to the Egyptian it makes me think of the story of atan right who who in order to have an other he basically creates Creation in order to have sex

With it you know he manifests himself and his hand is like the vagina and then he takes his penis and he jerks off into the cosmic darkness and he creates all of creation so that he can have sex with them right

You know so it's like it's so deep and intrinsic and I also think just you see this imagery everywhere of the vagina vulva and the phallus usually they're connected right and there's always all these rituals about having to raise the phallus make the phallus come to life and give us it's life-giving milk that's then transported into a receptacle there it's all about uh this the sexual rights you know and understanding procreation and that agricultural layer within that too yeah this is also extremely important because when you look at a lot

Of these agricultural myths right they really show all of the um like they show us uh like how much they understood the cycles and how and how they understood change like I think this is absolutely Paramount to understanding bronze blade religion they're connected to the death and rebirth Cycles they're breeding and changing crops and animals over time you know so they're understanding that things are evolving and are transforming and they're trying to participate in this process what they're understanding is ionic life right is this with their understanding is ionic life

Is this whole like process right it's about seeing life from outside of time you know so that you can get that whole big picture right this is why it's such a corruption with the Christians do when they make it about immortality because it destroys The Insider cycle you know you can't have immortality you have to die you know but what ionic life is is seeing it from outside seeing the whole cycle unfold right

Totally I sit here here to that that sounds like the orphic hymns to me that sounds like the orphic hymns to me and uh great the great Italian sauce she who is beyond the ion she governs the ion somebody's going to figure out the physics of that someday and I'm going to be able to transport myself right next to Dion and he and I are going to have a some kind of ceremony together I don't know what it's going to be but you know you know what I noticed

Though is people people throw this term out by accident and they'll they'll accidentally correctly Define magic well they'll say like we were our band was playing that night and the magic was happening we were all hitting the notes I'm like that's that's the definition of magic like you're you're will becoming

Realize in the world like you're trying to make this song as perfect as possible and then it happens like all the pieces are all the pieces are put together and you put together this amazing performance and then you're sitting there going it was magic like yeah that's what Matt that yeah it was that's as a as a as a musician as someone who deeply does this with percussion and Dion can talk about this too I think it's even more deep than that it's almost a possession experience when you

Get into the flow you're no longer cognizant you are literally in total communion in sync with the performers around you it's like you're telepathically linked when you're in a really good band in a really good jam session you transcend everything and you're connected to everyone around you the only other thing that does this is drugs you know what's that Mania that frenzy that pocket frenzy in the church they call it the Holy Spirit but that's that it's that's it's that possessed that possess it The Possession there's

No way they can figure out what that is it's something that happens though you know like have you ever had anything like that Dion where you felt like you were just taken by the music you know 100 100

Um and it's encouraged in all these different ancient cultures and when you go study music in Africa and the Amazon or any of the people I've studied music with they encourage that you know what's ironic with my first couple years of music lessons you know I was studying uh Persian music you know uh tombeck and my teacher spoke Farsi and I've studied I was studying some other uh African rhythms and I was having a hard time getting it the syncopation of it and he told me all

Right close your eyes he took my hands and he was let go like relax your hands let go go limp and he goes I'm no I'm gonna you're gonna piggyback he goes I'm gonna play but and he played with my hands he used my hands and played this weird rhythms and I just was limp and let him do it until I finally got it and he goes what I've done is put it into your muscle memory you know and they're they but the way in Africa they

Would do it they wouldn't teach it like that they just put you into a trance and you would automatically know how to do it because when I went into Africa to study that I would ask him well how do you do it you know like is there a technique and they're like no my friend like when the trance kicks in they all know what to do

Yeah that's kind of beautiful right and I think about this too like when we look at like one of the things I think we're having so much trouble when we're trying to study the orphan orphic text is that the music is so complicated and so removed you know like it's so hard to preserve music in an understandable form and especially because they were trying to keep it secret you know so it's like it's so hard for us to even get a a decent understanding of what's going on and it's it's beyond essential to the rights right

Can I say can I say Snappy you and Dion came up with a show yesterday that made me queasy right I I was queasy but I was drawn it was like this is a necessary ill this is it was it felt like going to an autopsy or something you know what I mean you don't like being there because somebody died but at the same time you're trying to figure out what happened you guys were doing that yesterday with the semen stuff and the laying on of the boys I think if you

Bring that culture forward a little bit it's enough to to kind of break us into the reality of what you know what actually happened um I'm sorry I just wanted to admit kudos to you guys by the way everybody out there you should see this it's it's sickening yet drawing and and interesting at the same time and where's the Pope

No I think like yeah you're getting important one of the things that I want to do and I think Dion's on board with with those episodes is kind of exposed of a lot of the extreme kind of insanity that's happening in a lot of these religious groups and a lot of these religious cults and what they're engaging in you know they're they're really it's really about experiencing the all and entering into these extended States and they're doing it through sex or through mutilation or through or through through breaking of taboos through pushing these boundaries

You know that's where the real magic is kind of happening is in these French States when you're you know I always think there's this really interesting quote that um by this philosopher Ludwig clagas he says that all that is Magic is wasteful you know real magic comes in the expenditure of stuff you know it comes in that sacrifice and in in the actual waste of things you know you experience it when you are just when you're destroying it it's almost paradoxical what do you guys think of that interesting

Well yeah I mean there's different uh theories about how the magic works and I think you know some moderate Scholars like to say that it's all transactional and that you're making a deal with the spirits but a lot of it especially with the more with the pagans is actually more about causality and you burn the incense or make the offerings to produce a natural effect which involves spirits but it's not so much about bribing the spirits to do your will there's plenty of spirits don't do it

Willingly they don't need a price or anything really they just want some attention maybe but uh there's a whole class of demons out there rats that will have intercourse with you in ways that you would not even contemplate yeah definitely what is all that about Dion Come on Dion Dion sex drugs and rock and roll please tell us about it yeah it is in the ancient world it is um

Hope just look at his costume he's a he's a sore he looks like a sorcerer

Well one thing I will say is uh we we mentioned is Inquisition torture machines you know those crazy machines that they were hooking people up to and torturing them now has evolved into the modern BDSM culture

So these dark experiences through controlling them and and at first I thought that BDSM stuff was so crazy like how could they be doing this because I saw it in the New Age Community like there's people that are yoga people then they have another side I'm like oh what what's this collie what are you what y'all doing and there's a therapeutic healing element to it when it's cognitive when it's unconscious and subconscious that it could take on your negative uh forms that's where you get rape and hurting

Other people when it's conscious you're you're healing the trauma through your body through Pleasure and Pain that because it the Pleasure and Pain is right up next to each other and you could it's really what we're talking about is exorcism exorcism through sex but it's not raping or forcing it onto somebody in the BDSM culture it's where you're taking it onto yourself are consciously doing it with the partner to dispel this dark energy in the in the ancient Sumerian World um there's a reason why when you just

Get when you finally even just got laid you feel good afterwards for for a while for a few days maybe you're good you're recharged you're not depressed after that um there's a reason why people who haven't got laid in a long time are somewhat depressed sometimes however even the ancient world they realize this and then Babylon they had the Temple of Ishtar where the pornia was going down this was a this wasn't just a bath house uh this wasn't just a place this wasn't like a dirty bath house this was a sacred religious experience and the women weren't just like

Treated as like um objects they were praised for the this this was a sacred ritual that was part of their culture you had the Temple of Ishtar right next to the Temple of Marduk and they both it was like two two parts of this it was like two equally important parts of the religion

No this is really interesting because you see a lot of this in parallels within Tantra right you have the right hand and the left hand and the right hand is understood as Shiva the phallus the light this is about austerity these are these yogis who go out and they starve themselves and enter into that intense meditation right it's no different though than the Shakti rights of the cave which are sexual and Drug based you know one is about denying life the other one is about affirming life

But in the end there the Polar Opposites get you to the same magnetic center right it brings you back to that want and this is why someone like the Buddha he's so adamant about forming the middle path and if you look at his story and you read it he went down the right hand path and he does the most intensive austerities to the point where he almost kills himself and he talks about going into these ecstatic states of bliss while in these near-death States you know like it's the same as BDSM yeah

I don't think it's any uh coincidence that those religions that hate sex are often the ones that teach you to leave Earth behind and they can't wait to die you know they have no connection to they don't take pleasure in life and so they want to die you know and they they're natural like I'm sorry God why for feeling these feelings that you created me to feel that it's like why they got this weird guilt trip about having sexual desires what is the most natural thing there

Could be so of course they want to die a lot of it has to do with this weird manifestation of power right they feel like if they can control their their libido and their sexuality that they can you know there's that they're these God men that they've enacted a city but we the reality is 99 of them can't control [\\h__\\h] they all turn into creeps you know yeah or they control it through brutal uh like governments and and uh inquisitions and [\\h__\\h] so

They use Force because they can't convince people through philosophy or rationality to to convert they have to convert by force this is the only way it seems to happen or through Power and money so or even pharmacia sorcery probably it's how they make converts

I got I got interviewed one time by a um dominatrix who was a high high value you know high-priced Dominatrix and her thing was um handcuffing businessmen and sodomizing them and she said this is a very common kind of therapeutical direction that they take there's something in the process of forcefully restraining those driven

Business people and sodomizing them that brings them back to a I don't know is this some kind of quantum something Dion what is it you know they do do that it's a that's normal in the corporate world it's because imagine you're going 40 hours screaming and yelling at people complete Alpha and in order to uh get that release you have to go submissive you know and you don't want somebody bigger than you you want somebody smaller than you that's why you're saying it's a female sometimes it could

Be a small little female at that and they need a release that's the opposite of what they're doing on a daily daily basis it puts them into a different state you know um and it's ironic why did uh they put the G-Spot there can you all answer that one I mean you're perfect it's fancy magic and all these World travels why how did that happen it was God's plan he wanted you to have you know we wanted you to engage with that kind of sexual stuff man

Herodot says that uh in Babylon the the women had to attend the Temple of Ishtar and agreed to have sex with any male that asked her once she performed this ritual the male had to give money to donate to the temple Scholars have called this sacred prostitution Herodotus however is unreliable yeah so I guess there's some nuances here but like you can see in the sources that they're talking about this stuff even in herodotus's time also on the island of Cyprus oh uh um you can in the celebration of Adonis you can either

Shave your head or if you want to keep your hair you can go to the temple where you offer yourself and any passerby um stranger can choose you out and it's a Port Harbor right any stranger can choose you out and that's considered your um service of Aphrodite right for the for that year so and it we know that the wife um has no constraint from her family whatsoever she has to go out and render this service so you know I've always wondered what did it do for these because it was very

Successful seemed to be a healthy institution what does it do for the women who then you know you're married to somebody and their marriage years are 20 years difference you know you're like 15 marrying a 35 year old you know now you're 40 and you've got an old man for a husband and uh thank goodness over the years you've done your service to Aphrodite and it's kept you in a place that is healthy I mean it makes me think of these like um Sumerian uh priest

Women you hear about there was a whole class of these women who basically they would live these lives where men they were like celebrities and men would come and give them gifts and sometimes they'd offer sexual favors most of the times they were engaging in conversation you're going on dates but some of these women were so powerful they were heading up entire political parties and exercising all kinds of control and this is something a lot of modern Scholars understand because they say oh the men have the real power and the authority

But they're all going to these women and simping for them who are telling them what the [\\h__\\h] do you know that's actually I'm actually glad I brought that up because there's a lot of very powerful women throughout history that had more some in some cases more power over Kings and Emperors at some points

You know like Livia or or Julia Augusta after the death of uh after the death of Augustus he she was more powerful than Tiberius who was the new emperor she would tell him what to do you know what I mean the Oracle at Delphi dictates what everyone thinks in the Mediterranean world when she comes out and says Socrates the smartest person the whole world flips out right like think about that kind of power right why are we dismissing them yeah yeah when you said they're planning the laws there

Right yeah these are the women doing I want you to notice with the Greek oracles that whenever somebody wants to go to war or they want to send out a colony they go to the oracles the oracles tell them where they can and cannot build civilization they tell them who can and cannot attack each other so amazing power from from this um it's not I wouldn't even call it matriarchal I would call it um a miracular female power

Yeah I can't dictating even the Romans every time they get into such a hard bad situation what do they do they go and run to the books The Sibling books and they open them up and say what's the instruction here let's find our find out where we are oh they said do this and this would happen or in desperation they do the sorties themselves right and they bust out Virgil we have a couple Emperors can do that but yeah this is it's so it's so interesting and it's so wild but I

Really wanted to kind of bring it back we had that question about the the Pleiades and this is an interesting one because in anthropology I remember when I was studying that in University this is widely considered one of the oldest mythological stories like we have the oldest version we have is the Australian Aboriginal version which is some of the old like based upon the star uh descriptions that they give in their oral tradition this takes it back like to some of the earliest migrations Out of Africa you know that they have the Seven Sisters myth so what do you guys

Know about this like like wretch have you come across any stories about the Pleiades well the Pleiades definitely come up in various places but uh it's hard to I'm not I can't think of too many rituals specifically it's a good marker for the seasons and Times of years according to where the culture is uh when the Pleiades Rises that's when you start to uh the bees start to make the honey according to Pliny so that's that's a good uh marker that's an important ritual marker yes followed by the dog

Star once that dog star Rises the Egyptians knew um we're gonna get our first reign of the year now this is it right there's also uh the Taurus Taurus is involved with the honey and uh and the pleadies are found in same part of this guy yeah Orion Taurus Pleiades in the dog star it's all in the same little area basically so it depends on the particular culture it's going to be different seasons right but yeah and then I know there's that missing one because I know in the group this is Mario and what's the deal with that you know six visible one invisible Seven

Stars and one right hand wow and you know what I realized the pythagoreans had this number as the most sacred number seven everything they did was with seven times uh you have appleeus talking about being dipped in the The Water by and and being basically baptized seven times in the water and he said because of Pythagorean Fame he says and then you have in the in the Deuteronomy they're talking about the high priest slaying the bowl and saying taking the blood on the hands of the priest and sprinkling it seven times on the horns of the altar so that's seven

The number seven pops up everywhere and you have to wonder is it Pleiades because look look at the sky look at Pleiades at night it's so cute you also have the hesperidis though the ones that are on the opposite pool that are surrounding the Big Dipper and then you have the seven the seven planets remember in Antiquity right the seven planets plus the the Moon and the Earth which make nine but like Orpheus uses a seven string liar to to play The Music of the Spheres right you have to make

Sure you and then after that point you have to wonder they're seeing this number all over the sky all over the place in nature it's got to be sacred at that point like that's you know what I mean like on the drug side it's the seven Venoms that form the heart of the communion

No way I gotta get into this I got to read that stuff man you gotta send me that link you know Italian it's Nero stuff I'm sorry go ahead oh well earlier brought up about how when the first Reigns come in the Nile um that deals with the dog star except that um it also deals with the intuition of the Nile and what would happen is the Nile floods right and all the silk goes to the side and it it makes it fertile for them to plant for the year because they're finally rain at that time yeah

Right but also another thing that happens is the crocodiles come out that's when they start they go up on shore net Sobek and when they would uh sacrifice the crocodiles they would take the fat and that's the original fat that they used for anointing was the Crocodile fat to anoint the Pharaohs wow and also what you're talking about with the the palladiads there in Egypt so we know that um the three great pyramids are a mirror image of uh Orion you know you could see that clearly but there's also the pleiads has a layout

Somewhere on the Nile I just can't remember all the temples that are connected and the Seven Sisters because a lot of the things in the sky mirror into the Egyptian temples oh yeah there's that famous famous ancient proverb As Above So Below yep yep priesthoods were always like if you the the design of the temple was always designed on the sky so the priesthoods were always trying to mimic the heavens and say if we mimic the heavens we'll be like Gods we'll be it will be blessed like so you have

They're building their structures based on what they see in the sky they're building their temples based on when they see the sky and doing the rituals the same way is equated with the star sign of Aquarius right and well actually like the morning sun will point right at it too we can see that the uh some gnostics were talking about like ascending to the heavens past the Pleiades I think it's in the nastines again with the ofyukas is involved there too but I found the part in Pliny for the Pleiades so I'll

Just quote a little bit about the in regard to bees either Seasons or else climates have changed or previous writers have been mistaken they go into retirement after the setting of the Pleiades and remain in hiding till after the rise so not till the beginning of Spring as writers have said and nobody in Italy thinks about hives before the Bean is in flower see so so it's all connected to various markers of Nature and when things go into uh exactly or they had it mapped out when they they

Can look at them alternating yeah go ahead so they'll do the rituals in according with you know to help them animals mate better or to bring the crops in or or whatever it is so there's lots of layers there for sure these people had it mapped out what the the they can trace the sky and figure out what time of the year it is what's what's gonna like they they had this like calendar up in the heavens basically they're and they're and they're and they also had stories up

There like oh there's that constellation here's the story that you know Zeus placed this constellation up there Athena put that one over there and that's the story of blah blah blah blah and they had this there was a their scripture was in the sky it's pretty it's kind of fashion you think about that it must have been even better under the influence of the compound drugs that they were using both plant and animal to be able to look at asterapy that plead that invisible plaid who is the carer

Carrier of that light of the star that as therapy um means the starry-faced right the starry Ops yeah you can translate that as face or you can translate his expression they can they looked at it as that which comes off of you when you're looking at somebody right in the face that thing that comes off of you and reaches them that's your Ops your gaze

And that's the heart of Bronze Age attorney and religion and so it doesn't surprise me at all that everybody's like what are the snakes about right when when that healing God is the very Central that's the son of dawn baby right we're talking about we're talking about the coming of Dawn and you cannot separate the buckets from this type of movement it's all part of the I think it's Pulaski and I think it goes all the way back prehistory to Pulaski what's so important right if we're taking this again from that um Stellar theological

Kind of perspective right Venus is the brightest star in the sky what what do you see when there's an eclipse we just had that hybrid Eclipse Venus was Bare for everyone the brightest thing you know this would have freaked out our ancestors you know you know what I noticed though is that all the oftentimes Zeus is credited for like putting the constellations up but like every time Lucifer is mentioned in any of the Latin texts it's always something to do with ordering the heavens so it's like which one is it every time

Ovid mentions Lucifer or lucretius or whoever it is and in these ancient Latin writers they're always whenever every time Lucifer is mentioned it's always Lucifer is ordering the heavens Lucifer ordering the heavens so you have this idea and then like back to what Ammon said if Lucifer is ruling the heavens and ordering the heavens and then you have this secret knowledge about Hades actually being a cathodonian

Aspect of Bacchus secretly then you're like who is the real ruler it's this Bacchus in an underground and Lucifer in the heavens and you had this one of each rolling the heavens one of them is ruling the underworld yeah and it's important too we connect this with the Kronos that ionic Chronos figure because he's also described as the one who initiates time right by Separation by dividing the universe right by taking that power from uranos and separating everything out so it's the same kind of action I've always seen this right like

If you look at Kronos Dionysus and Lucifer they're all kind of interconnected kind of the same energy in different forms right and the question yeah I would add Hades add Hades to that list said Hades and Hades having that cathodian aspective Bacchus that's what I said yeah yeah but yeah to my list for sure you want to add Hades too because right like there's also that understanding when you look at the Chronos myth what happens he's stripped of his authority in in in on Earth but he's given authority over

The underworld right he's Bound in arabis but there's this whole these rights right when I was reading the probius and they talk about this where they take during the saturnalia they take the deity and they would literally unbind him they'd have these Woolen chains that they would take off yeah and then he would go around and distribute and give everyone gifts and his whole nature would change this is why the idea of the Christian devil is just everything that they think is Pagan is the devil and this is why you

Have that's why Saturn's so Central it's by Lucifer that's why Lucifer becomes the name of Satan later on this is this that's not an accident that that that's a natural response of calling Lucifer the one who orders the heavens or and and so you have and and so the um what was I gonna say oh and Saturn people think Saturn is like just gets replaced by Zeus and that's the end of them if you read the orphic text he goes down and he gets he gets a section of Hades allotted to him

Called Elysium now what's Elysium elysium's the best part of Hades it's basically Heaven it's where all the good people go yeah that's where Achilles winds up right Predator is actually the ruler of Heaven basically yeah so as above Lucifer ordering the heavens like in all the texts say and Below said in ruling the heavens in the Underworld

So yeah it's really crazy and the Christians knew this the Christians knew that this was their dual opposite yeah a lot of people kind of see a connection between Saturn and Satan but for the Greeks in Romans Saturn was not evil he wasn't like right the Boogeyman and never was even even in like just yesterday I was reading photinis any ads and it's talking about uh Kronos in a very positive way and and then also in the orific tradition and other or saturnalia it sounds like a great holiday

S he rules the Golden Age yeah exactly you know what it is is that the Christians they dumb everything down into this simplistic single lifetime black and white monotheistic Ridiculousness you know it's just childish and they misunderstand like Kronos is a terrifying figure because he is the reaper right he stands behind you with the knife saying adapt or you die right or you get destroyed and get reborn Anew but they understood death and violence very differently this is not the Christian understanding right Kronos is not a a figure of evil he's a figure of transformation who initiates that cycle

Who keeps us evolving who prevents stagnation right Jesus was putting Jesus as a child trafficker was putting children into the death state in order to burn off their mortality and we have examples of this when he shows up a cemetery and a kid's like I love you and he's like I want to be with you and he's like all right here's tell you what you got to do do this and a lot of we get a lot of that stuff you guys were talking about right

That death state is integral a modern Christianity is nothing absolutely nothing of the operation of the original mystery standing in church I'm going to say this I'm going to say this just as a rational historian I'm not a historian I'm a classical philologist and somebody who looks at these texts I can tell you for a fact the operation of the early Christian mystery was nothing to do nothing to do with standing in a church walking down an aisle and taking a piece of bread that is magically transformed

In your mouth it has nothing to do with that um and I think Christians today if they were to sign if you could take us back Dion get somebody to make a movie to take us back into this time period to show what that original mystery was so that evangelicals and Catholics alike will watch it and their mouths will be open and they will see for the first time they'll see this is what your mystery is this is where you come from I want to see that kid I want to see that kid arrested with Jesus I want to see

That kid arrested with Jesus I want to see what that scene played I don't want to know why Jesus is yelling he's yelling at the Roman soldiers that are coming to rest of me saying well you didn't need those weapons right I'm not a child trafficker and off runs the little naked boy that's with him I want to know what you know we can do to show the reality how do we show the Dan how do we show the world this reality how do we make

The mystery known wow well you know what talking about putting uh boys in the oven Jesus does it as a child in the Syriac infancy gospel he puts boys in the oven they're afraid of him there's multiple stories in the Syriac infancy gospel they're afraid of them the kids hide from them and in one of the stories he puts them in the butt he puts them in the oven and we also know other uh different peoples throughout history have been put in ovens to burn off their immortality

Is that uh Dionysus was put in the oven like like that red-headed kid in the Codex waluani who's bait they've roast him over the coals right and then collect his blood The Witches collect his blood and combine it with the gem out of the brain of that guard yeah oh God I think about uh wretch in his book on magic carpets the opening picture right is a guy who's in his fumigation box over fire isn't that right yeah yeah and then there's also stories of Abraham being stuck into a furnace by Nimrod and uh the Flames don't hurt him

Or whatever and so there's a recurring theme there for sure

Huh what do you think about what do you think about Mary and the being fed in the temple is that some kind of reference to the to the fumigations because it says she's in the very central part of the temple the auditon she's in the innermost part so she'd be partaking of whatever it is that they're partaking do you think Mary was getting high as well do you think that was is that a part of our whole you know cult I I would think it has to be if she's in the identity you know you don't they

Don't let just anybody in there and even the high priest is only supposed to go in there at like Yom Kippur or whatever to spread the blood so or what you know very rarely do they go in there so if they're bringing in women and they're that totally that one fact alone changes everything modern people think they know about their religion has nothing you know and the role of women in that early religion it turns everything upside down just that one fact exactly what's that thing

That she's being nourished with according to the gospel of James which is in Greek I looked at the Greek there's no question about it right it's not metaphorical at all it says that Mary was raised in the temple and as soon as she turns 12 they start trying to they're going to give her off to somebody right the guy's all coming all these old creeps come in with their rods that they're going to give them and they draw lots for right and that's how Joseph gets her and he's like I don't

Want her what are you doing I'm an old dude and she's a virgin right what it says that she's fat in the temple imagine that if these highest of high priests are only able to get in there once a year what are you doing with girls inside there what is that College of priestesses doing I mean dang that's as Pagan as it gets people yeah it must be connected to a sure or something originally or kadasha these Temple prostitutes but there's also these homosexual Temple prostitutes and so it goes on and on and the homosexual

Processor related to the dog star and stuff there's so there's all this weird stuff that that is left in the text but has been Twisted in in in and they're called dogs themselves because of how they have sex so right

Do you mind if I share a couple slides real quick just I just want to lay something out real quick for some people yeah yeah share away let's see all right first of all I just want to show people what I mean by Lucifer ordering the heavens you know opens always metamorphosis describes looser ordering the heavens and he says that you know all these all these uh constellations and the heavens basically is set by Lucifer right so you have that that but that's but that's just I just want to let put that before I show this um then there's the underworld this is

Where the Ancients believe that you go when we die and this is the map of the underworld this is Hades up on here up on Top This is called the Blessed Isle Elysium and you're like what is that what's going on there right well turns out if we actually look at what the what the agents are saying what the sources are saying um according to Homer you know uh Elysium would be called The Fortune Isles pindar and hessia had both say that Kronos is the ruler of Heaven

That's correct that's what happens when you if you actually look at the orphic hymns that's who after Cronus leaves happen he goes down to the underworld and he rules the Blessed Isle and turns out what is the Blessed Isle pandar describes it perfectly the good receive a life free from toil they're going back to the Golden Age not scrapping with the strength of their arms nor the water of the sea for the sake of poor sustenance but in the presence of the honored Gods those who

Gladly kept their Odes enjoy a life without tears while the others undergo a toil that is unbearable to look at those who have preserved three times on either side to keep their souls free from Wander wrongdoing follow Zeus's road to the to the end to the Tower of Cronus see if colonists rules there where ocean breezes blow around the Isle of the blessed and the flowers of the gold are blazing some from Splendid trees on land while Waters nurture others with these wreaths and garlands and of flowers they

Entwine their hands according to the righteous consoles of this is a king from the uh ancient Greece whom the great father the husband of Raya whose Throne is above all keeps their keeps it close blessed as so look this idea of a Heavenly realm that you go for the good people who keep who keep their Oaths who aren't like there's nothing to do with your faith oh if you had faith in Saturn you come here they didn't say that say the good people go here and so

This idea of of Heaven and Hell and all this stuff this is where it all comes from guys this is again right don't the orphics teach people about the passwords to get through the different Gates how you're supposed to to cross the river sticks how you have to pay the ferrymen how you have to have the right things written on your head yeah

Yeah as a matter of fact you can circumvent the whole deal man you got to stay away from where the crowd goes right because here's what's gonna happen right and you're like what and they're like shut up it's analog okay so here's what's gonna happen they will come you'll see the crowds there see the crowds waiting and they they're pushing and shoving and pushing towards this water and it's the water of forgetfulness so don't go there so the secret that we know is that you change

Your direction and you walk as far as you can off in the distance in the dry distance and by the way when you get there you're so parched died you just died you're so parched that it's it's really hard not to drink that water right right it's a driving first right but you press on through that desert till it's you come to the Guardians there'll be Guardians just take my word for people guarding what they're guarding is another the river right and that's the river of memory

You want to go to that so keep your thirst off of leafy but don't drink when it's your impulse to drink hold it and then go to memory and once you have memory then you're you know you've broken the cycle right you're now outside the system and that whole mystery initiation is about taking you outside the system so that when you come back and enter the system doing things to affect the system is not odd to you right it's the birth of a Marcus it's the birth of somebody who's seen that you only get that through the initiation

The initiation which there is none I'm left in the modern in in any of the modern monotheistic fundamentalistic sex mystery I think it was Plato who said that's there are some ancients in the initiates in the ancient world who had remembered their past lives because they did this process over and over again yeah it's just quantum physics right it's just quantum physics and then eventually you end up not stopping eventually you reach a level of apotheosis and you you're you're not gonna they're not gonna allow you to go

Back into into the world anymore you have to stay at Elysium you are a God now you've reached gnosis you're done you can't go back to the world you're too you you have exited the realm of reincarnation yeah you're returning back to the monad right you go back to the to the cosmic egg and then to the womb for to wait for the end of the time cycle when everyone else will eventually rejoin us in the one you know you know we have to go back you know it does jump

Back into the pool it's all of those people like Jesus right it's all of those people like Jesus who want to be able to exhibit control within that environment right people don't realize outside of this system Jesus is a wanted criminal he's a dude who was arrested in the public park with a naked kid at the top of a child um trafficking scheme that involved drugs yeah

Drugs will show us everything man there aren't you can't listen you evangelicals out there um you can't take his fingerprints off that boy you can't do that I'm sorry but Jesus Jesus was touching that boy in the park

Right yeah so this The Secret of magic that the Christians won't tell you is that actually magic is possible because humans are Divine in ourselves we have a spark of the Divine depending on how you want to think of that and after initiation you realize that and so you can work Magic exactly and what a lot of these Christians won't tell you is that all of the day all of this is necromancy right all of the deities are these ancient beings primordial beings that have already gone through these Cycles right

So when Lucifer is or lucifera comes and tells you that she they're going to show you the way how to become a God how to become like them they mean it and when when the god of the Christians Jehovah is telling you he wants to confuse your language to prevent you from becoming like him he means that you know right and every Evangelical watching just said see they're satanists I told you I told you there's Satanist they're doing with and they're exactly right it is why he

Said your Jehovah's a liar ma'am I'm sorry but you take this stuff and your eyes will be open and she was like okay right and he drew her in and she opened her eyes next thing you knew she was naked she was naked right oh why do you think she was naked people people even Adam got on some kind of substance that made them get naked and do things that Joe thought were nasty yeah fantastic oh God it just became the Beast with two backs but yeah

But like when I think about the the whole essence of Christianity to me it's trying to stop time it's trying to maintain a type of Perpetual order it wants to subvert all of the physics of the universe they don't want to have to be held accountable for their crimes or their actions they don't want to die and be reborn they want to maintain their patriarchal hegemony that's the greatest sin imaginable in paganism to resist transformation to resist time that's the only thing that Cronus will kill you for that's true

It's just nature man it's just nature yeah so they want to they want to end time they want to bring about the apocalypse and they want to end life on this planet it's anti-gaya

Your mother your Gaia it's well that's who Satan is right who is Satan really people always ask this and I don't like to tell them but that's who they're talking about they're talking about Gaia who's Lucifer's mother right well that but don't that's right yeah that's the threat that's the three layers that we're talking about Lucifer order in the heavens Gaia Earth and then Saturn in the Underworld that's it that's your three layers of of Satan right there you notice we have our three genders too right you get your

Your bigender your your female and your male yeah there is no getting to any of the mystery without a bi-gendered entity definitely fannies or Dionysus right who's the reflection of fannies in our current reality who shows us how to reassemble and go back right and this is the this is the Paradox that people don't understand right what at the heart of the orphic right is that sporadmos where you're ripped apart why is the the saint Orpheus ripped apart and turned into a head this is a good thing because in that moment he experiences the all and he's transformed into everything you

Know I've been wondering ionic life I've been wondering if the Christian martyr cult is is is sort of adopting that mentality the orphic like going it's coming out of it it's a perversion of it you know we're we're right they're trying to shift uh worship from the gods and from this from the spirits to just their ancestors you know to just their designated few right like retch talks about this a lot he's got some really good ideas well like Jesus is a solipsist he thinks he's the only one

Who's Divine and everybody else is just like it says in Genesis uh Adam was made from the clay and there's nothing Divine about us and uh so he's the only God and everybody has to worship him so it's this narcissistic solipsism

And uh the valentinians also say that Abraham is the or at least according to uh the horiziologist they say that uh Abraham was insane and he thought he created the universe and he's the demiurge and so it's like it's like they had a it's like Abraham had was initiated and then he had this bad trip and he had a solipsistic time and he thought he was the only one that was divine and now he has to like what about you can hurt everybody's death called and start cutting penises

And doing all what about his ideas what about his idea of the Kingdom of Heaven being within you I think that's right you know the gnostics could interpret it in a way that all humans are Divine but uh you know they also wanted to leave Earth behind and end life on this planet so I think like again like they're doing something similar to the orphics right they're trying to induce this possession but the possession is a very different kind of position they want you to give up your

Reason they want you to submit to their will so if you like when I was involved in a lot of these Christian Christian rituals and stuff they they mirror the Pagan rituals but they they enslave you they mentally enslave you and they they break you down but it's the same kind of magical processes it's the same kind of incantations and hymns and what you know we were saying the Jesus prayer constantly invoking ourselves as Sin itself right like how [\\h__\\h] up is that you know when you equate yourself with the problem like this is how much

They're trying to separate you from Christ in order to become Christ life you have to deny your entire deity you have to accept that you are everything that's wrong with the universe and you have to take responsibility for it I'm not responsible for the universe seriously [\\h__\\h] that [\\h__\\h] yeah I didn't get I didn't get arrested with a naked kid in the public park at 4am either right so I don't want that credit Jesus thank you very much um what do you what do you do with Marge Taylor green MTG what do you do

With her when she was in New York Snappy and they were remember her bodyguard was around her or whatever they are I don't know if she's got Secret Service or what but she had a group of she had a group of armed guards around her with everybody around her yelling oh my God and the stuff you were hearing it was all with the I thought I got so excited for a minute because I thought oh my God I'm watching a Roman parade right I'm watching the people who were there to preserve the Holiness the polytheists who are there

To preserve the sanctity of Rome are there yelling at her get out get out of New York we don't want you and awful things about who she is and who and then she comments about the zombies the Cannabis smoking zombies that are rising up against the Christians um it's almost like magic and reality or kind of blending now yeah well remember during covid uh Trump brought out this this doctor from Africa who said that the virus was spread by sperm demons actually

And homosexuals and all these things craziness it's a death cult and it really is she she talks about Jew laser to that woman how can anyone take her seriously like there there are conspiracies and then there's that kind of [\\h__\\h] like what is that with Rio has space lasers I hope they use it on her you know like take her out

It's so absurd but you're right you know we're seeing this um there's this moment of this extremification that's happening right where like these two sides are becoming so polarized like where you're seeing it like you can't have no disagreement on either side and then they're they're both so extremified and they want to see each other as like the absolute evil it's become like this this cartoon show like

I mean you know being being queer I see a lot of these parallels with when you look back at like the um the gay rights movement like that was happening in the 70s and the 80s with like that Anita Bryant character if anyone watched the recent Contra points video go watch that because then I'll show you a lot of what's what's going on right now with this extremification oftentimes when

Things start to get good for a marginalized group The the freaking Crazies come out to try and shut it down and they want to protect the children they're always yelling about they they're they're trying to confuse your mind they're trying to manipulate you they play on things that we're all passionate about that we all care about to exploit and attack the most vulnerable you know right now there are over 500 bills in the U.S against trans people 500. you know

So that's what they it that's what they call it in in Grace and Antiquity they call that corrupting the youth yeah the abrahamic religions need constant scapegoats to explain why life in their culture is so shitty you know and why God is always punishing why their Tyrant is always flipping out about this or that and you know if you love gay people then hurricanes happen apparently that's how it happens that's his number one thing God just takes the butt sex and he's gonna send hurricanes if you if you don't cut it

Out about sex almost all of these people who Express these extreme bigotry right they come from two places they're either people who have suffered extreme abuse and so they're so oppressed they kind of lash out at marginalized people people who scare them who they can step down on or their perpetrators of the [\\h__\\h] themselves right you notice that all these people yelling about the trans stuff are the groomers they they are you know they are the Baptist preachers you really want to talk about protecting children why are we talking about guns

Why aren't we talking about the Baptists how many times an article has dropped where there is a pastor it's not just the Catholic church but it's the Catholic Church a lot but not but at a pastor or a priest who was formerly on camera talking about how you know the gays are trying to get your children and then all of a sudden a month later they're in the news for like touching a kid how often does that happen it happens so it happens like literally like every

Once every couple months you see that didn't that happen to the governor of Tennessee recently or maybe it was a lieutenant governor who was passing the anti-trans bill and he was involved in something yeah he was he was on Twitter

She was on Twitter commenting and liking this this uh like this this I don't know who it was but it was somebody who was like it was like yeah you're sexy I love you like it was like like you're and it was like what is going on like it's like it's so ironic this is what happens when you try to pray away the gay it just doesn't work that's what it is they hate themselves they're denying reality you know when you when you do this kind of mental

Stuff and you just torture yourself you're gonna lash out and hurt those around you right it's it's just it's it's normal right so all of these people are just these PTSD self-abused angry people who are afraid to um be themselves and to have any sort of [\\h__\\h] passion in any kind of regard because to be passionate about anything is to be a sinner you know right it's a successful except for Jesus you can you want to have sex with Jesus that's okay there's a deep S M trip within

Christianity in particular and it's self-flagellation and all the you know atoning for sins through pain because that's how you learn lessons apparently you don't have to actually you know become a better person just in on the inside you just hurt yourself until you feel sorry I guess I don't know so a Snappy carrying the burden

Um do you have to snap it do you have to enter into a place of Freedom now that spirit is out there just like that spirit that drove that good spirit that drove Marjorie out of New York City is just kind of like purified it you know the pr of her presence is that the same thing that is coming that you feel coming to the surface that complete freedom to fight against it's that bakic like do you feel that you are a modern day Bakken

100 Like that's been like this is something I've noticed throughout my whole life is is The more I've accepted myself the more it's taken me down that path right and the more you learn to accept and appreciate world and these these Christian these monotheisms they want to reduce everything down to black and white they want they don't want to allow Nuance they don't want to allow any expansion you know as soon as I started to get into this kind of stuff my entire world opened up you know and it began with an exploration what is really evil what are they calling evil

You know for me I really wanted to understand violence and it did a lot of meditation I did a lot of reading about violence which is what brought me to Saturn and brought me to these Pagan interpretations because they're the ones who were able to put it in a cosmic approach and understand it as this tool for evolution and for change you know and it's like for the first time things started to make sense it wasn't about reduction about this personal narcissistic approach approach to Salvation that's what all these

Christians are doing you know they're reducing everything it's it's ugh

You gotta help them out I guess right because they're kind of victims right sitting in the sitting in their pews listening to their reinforcement of some prayers rich and I are trying to do now we're starting another show here on drawing down the stars where it's called the The Witch's guide to realities or chaos which is guide to realities and the idea is we want to we want people to understand that you can take back your spirituality you know you can approach it from a perspective of reason you can

Go out and try things you can go do the entheogens see what works for you throw away the what doesn't work approach this like a scientist you know journal and Chronicle what you're doing and make it about and take it back for yourself you know that's what magic is like we were saying at the beginning here it's that personal um spiritual experience you know you can have that and it's valid and you can take these things from everywhere and create something for yourself you know yeah if your spirituality isn't unique

To you then you're probably just following orders and doing lip service it's all you're really doing and that's not going to raise your Consciousness in any way that's just that's the opposite really so to me like really being into involved in this is about being an artist you know we're trying to connect to these spirits and you do that through this this artistic connection like we're visualizing these these these beings you know in our minds I we're in in their totality not just the sense of sight but all senses you

Know and then we're trying to connect to them in the song and then through speech and you're trying to invite them into your everyday life you know it's like this active participation that's what I want people to get out of it don't just listen to what I'm saying go and try it for yourself you know you'll you'll be surprised with what works I'm telling you you are the Antichrist man

It's not hard to be the Antichrist you know just just stop letting yourself be dictated you know don't fall for that kid the the word heresy is derived from uh the root to meaning to choose so a heretic is just somebody who chooses for themselves what they want to believe and what makes sense to them rather than just blindly following orders that's all it is so I definitely want to encourage heresy and because that's philosophy that's what it's the same thing

Dude you are so busted when when the Christians take over I am so gonna flip on you wretch I'm sorry but I'm gonna be like look okay this guy was behind it the whole time no he's fine listen to what you just said it's it's creepy satanic stuff that you're doing right not that I don't fully support it but you know I got you but like honestly I wish like so many people would just like relax and try to approach reality in a in a very in a playful artistic way in an engaging way

Like go smoke some weed sit and meditate you'll be surprised if you listen and you confront yourself what you find yeah our communion of uh esterion works a lot better than a sip of wine I can tell you that and some crackers welcome to Welcome to our church

In all seriousness though I mean aren't you talking really rich this very same physics going on in the background there I mean we're talking church and the use of a communion you know aren't aren't you really talking about real mystery there I mean do do we get it as Christians do we do we really get that communion I don't think so no and it's it's a total uh distraction and the way that they you know demonize plants or whatever it's it's they're trying to point us in the exact opposite

Direction and anything else is to risk Hellfire so don't look you know don't look at the man behind the curtain it's The Wizard of Oz basically you know and they get away with it because like we also have to have an honest discussion right the the path of the magician or the witch is not an easy path right and when you're engaging with reality in its entirety in the all when you're trying to seek the all you run dangers you know and people do fall prey

To things like addiction you know when you're engaging with sex and drugs it's always something you have to worry about you have to practice like Emma always says the dote in the antidote balance in all things like this is not something you can just do willy-nilly at the same time do you think Snappy it could be that we have a we have a recipe that we could give ourselves that could bring us could bring us to a level where our brains are actually functioning at a higher uh you know with higher

Efficiency and parts of them parts of your brain is talking to other parts that it doesn't usually talk to you do you think there's like a potential for real Health behind this this is already happening we already know this happens with intense yoga and meditation and like this is something that rich and I are going to talk about he reprogrammed in genetically like altered his genes through the use of psychedelics do you want to talk about that a bit well I don't know that I altered my genes but through what's called neuroplasticity

You can uh shift your brain and and I know that DMT definitely uh definitely trans rewired my brain though who knows with epigenetics uh there's all kinds of uh things that psychedelics could be could actually be altering your DNA in certain ways too so

Um science is kind of vague on that as I understand it but uh

Science has shown that psilocybin is actually the best medicine for obsessive compulsive disorder because it temporarily heightens neuroplasticity which allows you to reset your brain and break patterns and uh and to question your assumptions and to uh to just it's you know what it is you're you're like you're all so close to describing what what happens when you have this rewiring from psychedelics and what it is is it's like an Awakening it's like a sobering thing that happens like all of a sudden you go oh my God

What the [\\h__\\h] am I doing I gotta stop doing this this is the [\\h__\\h] I need to fix right now and then that week you will fix that thing or like oh my god I've been I've been my whole room's been a mess for months I haven't cleaned the room out all the drawers are just stuffed with [\\h__\\h] that I just throw in there I wanna I wanna I'm gonna reorder it and make it all like nice and organized like it does that to you for me it was DMT not psilocybin but from what I understand they're pretty

Much the same molecular structure yeah yeah they're very very similar like when I've done psilocybin what I what I find is I you have less intense hallucinations but very similar so like I still get the same 3D kind of effects and the snake effects you see snakes all the time on both DMT and on on mushrooms yeah you know and like that is I find so there is a similarity but it's also like um DMT is usually over in a minute right for a couple minutes five minutes yeah

Yeah whereas like psilocybin comes in waves and depending on how much you do it can it can last for a day or two yeah DMT as soon as you take it you're right away You're Gonna Hear a buzzing sound like like a like a like a flies in your ear I think it's louder and louder and louder and then eventually you just you're gone and you have that breaking moment and then after five after a couple minutes three to five minutes you'll start here you're something like

A pin drop or something will bring you back to reality oh [\\h__\\h] I'm back and then that's it it's like it's like there's no hangover no nothing it's like it didn't even happen almost but you will come out of it with that realization like you know you know there's a post not realization when you and then after intercourse it's kind of like that where you come back out of it and you're like oh [\\h__\\h] I gotta fix my life it's it's amazing it's amazing you get a fresh perspectives and you you get your

Priorities in order and and if you're feeling guilty about something it's going to confront you with it probably that's a good thing right yeah and it's a good thing so you can actually learn your lesson and move Beyond rather than just you know seeing some Hail Mary's or something and then going to molest some more kids or whatever you're doing you know but this is actually a good place to start winding things down just because we're actually going to be getting together next week for another witch's Symposium

That's going to be focused all on in theogens you know so you guys are welcome if you want to join but yeah it was definitely going to be rich and Dion and I again talking about that so if anyone has any last few questions here for Ammon or for Neil or for retro eye let us know and you know thank you all for for tuning in it's been a huge amount of fun and is there anything you guys want to just end off on when we're

Talking about magic here you know and what you want to leave our audience with yeah I'll I'll start it's uh much more reasoned than you think it is and there's a there's a beauty to it there's a real artistic Beauty to it when you see that classical Magic wow it just uh it's gorgeous and I would recommend anybody anybody that can jump in I'm giving you the opposite direction it's a satanic thing right but jump into that how this ancient Magic

Formed the world around itself formed the world around itself love it thank you for having me Snappy my pleasure our pleasure with Rich yeah thanks for being here what about you Neil you have anything to add uh Neil man I I really do think that we are changing the changing the way people look at religion it no longer is their Monopoly on these monotheistic Bible religions that you have to choose between you know some sort of judeo-christian Islamic religion or you have to go all the way to India

And choose their religions no no we're bringing back the actual ancient rights that predate the Bible we're going back to ancient Greece we're going back to ancient Rome we're going back to ancient Egypt we're going back to all these ancient even African Traditions we're bringing those let's bring it all back to the table and give people the options give people the option to choose the real ancient rights that all these modern religions face it Christianity is a modern religion it's not an ancient religion it's a modern religion these

Modern religious borrowed from these ancient religions and we're showing you where it came from so that you can have a better understanding of these rights and then you can have a more fulfilled religious life

Yeah

So I'll just uh finish off by saying to me magic grows when you know thyself and you overcome your fears and you face your fears these are all related process that's how you realize you're a Divine being and uh know yourself and you'll know the Gods yeah that's that's beautiful Rich yeah I'm gonna see on just almost the same thing that's already been elucidated here it's that magic is this two-fold thing it's it's taking back religion and spirituality for yourself you get to Define it you get to explore the universe and take what works for you and discard what doesn't you are the

Authority you take authority for yourself as a Divine being as the Divine beings that we all are you know and also want to stress that a huge part of this is like retro saying it's about that shadow work it's about going into yourself and facing yourself and transforming shedding your skin like the snake to be reborn Anew you know this is powerful stuff and uh it's it's not always pleasant but it's worth it it's truly transformative you know

Well thank you everyone yeah can I just say hail Satan to that he'll say to that thank you thank you guys so much and yeah we'll see you all next week for the next witches Symposium and thank you guys all for tuning in we're drawing down the stars have a good one